Hollywood Pitch Meetings: Pro Tip For Success

Announcer: Welcome to Producing Unscripted with Joke and Biagio.

Angry Man: Is this some kind of joke?

Confused Woman: Biagio-WHO???

Announcer: This episode…

Biagio: Its episode 46 and we’ve got a pro tip for successful Hollywood pitch meetings. Learn how to pivot your pitch. The right and wrong way to answer questions from studio or network execs. One of our film making friends just won a million dollars. Seriously, a million bucks! And me and Joke do a little role play.

Joke: “Noo! Yees! Oh, nooo! That’s great!”

Announcer: Music courtesy of Dave Pelman Music, davepelman.com

Biagio: Hey everybody! She’s Joke.

Joke: He’s Biagio.

Biagio: We’re married. We make unscripted film and television and want to help you do the same.

Joke: Hopefully by teaming up with us.

Biagio: So first of all, before we get rolling this week, we want to send out a big congrats to our good friend Scot Zabielski affectionately known as Scot Z to those who even after all these years are afraid of mispronouncing his last name. Scott just won a Doritos Crash the Super Bowl contest with his commercial, “The Middle Seat.”

Joke: Yes, it was great. I thought it was the best one.

Biagio: Well clearly everyone thought it was the best one because he won.

Joke: But I thought it was even compared to some of the other commercials airing during the super bowl. I’m just saying not even like, is it the best one of Doritos? Obviously! But I thought it was even up there with all the other commercials.

Biagio: Oh yeah, it definitely stood on its own. Thanks to all of you! I know those of you who follow us on Facebook, you saw us put out there a little bit about Scott’s commercial and we asked you if you had some time to send over a vote. I think he would have won anyways because the commercial was just terrific.

But you know we know Scott going way back. We knew him back when he was an editor and now he’s doing a lot of TV directing and wants to break into commercials. I think this was the first commercial he’s ever directed or something, right?

Joke: Yeah, I think he was planning on making a commercial anyway just to have one spec on his directing reel so he could prove to the commercial people that he could tell a story in 30 seconds. He was like, “Well why not do one for Doritos? If nothing happens of it I’ll have a spec commercial for my reel anyway and if something happens, its gravy.” We’re super excited for him and his wife; and that’s actually his baby in the commercial.

Biagio: Yeah, it is. His baby who I think his college fund is going to get nicely padded by the million dollars he just won from Doritos! So, congrats!

Joke: I hope he put some of that away.

Biagio: Scott’s a very smart guy, I’m sure he’s going to put just about all of it away.

Joke: Yeah. And he’s not just a great creative mind, but Scott which some people don’t know is also a reserve sheriff’s deputy.

Biagio: That’s right!

Joke: Here in West Hollywood. And I think his claim to fame before crashing the Super Bowl was, I think he actually pulled over Paris Hilton one point.

Biagio: That’s right! It was like in Gawker and Perez Hilton.

Joke: Yeah, I think TMZ or some paparazzi had been following, so literally that was him in the pictures pulling over Paris Hilton.

Biagio: Hilarious!

Joke: Anyway, now he’s got much better claim to fame with winning the Super Bowl contest. But one of the reasons we’re bringing it up is not just because he prays on a solid guy and a great friend of ours, but it’s also, I think it shows again that Hollywood is not one of those things where once you break into the business the door opens up and light comes from the sky and it’s like, “Welcome to our all-you-can-eat buffet and go at it.”

Even within the industry, you have to keep proving yourself, and you have to keep proving yourself in different genres.

So while Scott’s a very well respected TV director, the commercial world is looking at him going, “Yeah, but can you tell a story in 30 seconds?” It’s a different skill set. And so he had to figure out, “You know what, I’m going to make a spec commercial to prove that I can.” It’s one of those things just to keep in mind that you have to keep proving yourself. Even we run into that sometimes.

Biagio: That’s right! Yeah!

Joke: Where maybe people know us for a docu series and they’re like, “Well can you really do competition?” And we had to prove that we could do competition. So there’s different things and it’s good to know that even when you hear these success stories, its people who are constantly proving themselves.

Biagio: Yes, and speaking of proving yourself, that gets us the main topic of today’s podcast because proving yourself when you’re pitching any kind of project, I mean any kind of project, screenplay, film, TV show, web series, whatever, proving yourself really begins with the very first meeting with whatever network or studio exec or money person you hope to pitch your project to.

And that’s why I said today’s advice really is pertinent to anyone pitching any kind of project. No matter what area of showbiz you’re working in, you need today’s advice. I can tell you, today’s advice is one of the things that I think has made us very successful over the years.

Now we just got back from real screen which some of you know is the giant convention for factual programming, unscripted projects and reality TV. Basically, when you go to realscreen, there’s a lot of people bringing their projects and at some point, the whole thing turned into a giant speed pitch. Right, Joke?

Joke: Yeah, it’s like speed dating but trying to sell pitches and it gets pretty crazy real fast.

Biagio: Yeah, and what’s funny is when you walk into the main conference room where realscreen is happening, it’s a really weird experience because all of a sudden you see people everywhere pitching projects to studio network executives and you are literally overhearing their pitches. And if you pay attention, you can hear their pitches and see the network’s or the studio’s reaction to their pitches and pick up a lot.

Joke: It’s kind of part of my favourite – you know how much I love watching people? This is like that on steroids because you’re sitting in a coach and literally 3 feet away from you is someone pitching their heart out on their idea. Not only are you forming your own opinions on the idea but then you can hear what the network is saying and what kind of feedback they’re asking for or giving, or questions their asking and then you’ll hear what the person pitching is doing and you’re just like, “Noo! Yeah! Oh, noo! That’s great!” And so it’s like a lot of play-along.

Biagio: It kind of is. You know we’re always rooting because a lot of people pitching at realscreen are newbies. They’re not proven production companies. They don’t have agents and you’re kind of rooting for them to do good. Unfortunately the vast majority do horribly and that’s one of the things we are going to help you with today.

When you’re looking at all of these pitches going out across room, it’s really easy to tell the newbies from the successful producers for one giant reason. This is so true and I am going to sum it up like this.

With successful producers, when they’re talking to a network or studio, you hear them pivot their pitches. ‘Pivot their pitches,’ what does that mean?

First, I want to give a little context as to why you would want to pivot your pitch. We’ve talked about on earlier podcast episodes, there’s really two ways to work in any part of the entertainment business, right? Either you’re going to pay for your project yourself, meaning who cares what anybody else thinks, you’re going to sit down, you’re going to pay for every piece of it, you’re going to finish it. That’s kind of more Indie film but doesn’t work so well on TV, but that’s one way to work.

Or, the way 95% of the projects that we make work, and that most producers make work, is that you are going to somehow get funding for your project. And whether that’s from a studio or a network or a money person, the minute you go and you ask someone for money, you’re instantly collaborating with that person.

They’re your new partners. They’re paying, which means they’re becoming part of the team and so you’ll be working together with them to make a project you can all be proud of. That starts in the very beginning with that first pitch meeting.

So now you have pitched them an idea. But, what if your pitch isn’t perfect for them? So what you do is ‘pivot your pitch’. Which essentially mean, take the information you’re getting in the moment from your executive and change the pitch or change the entire meaning.

Joke: Listen, the worst meetings are the ones where you do your whole song and dance and then it’s just like blank faces or nice smiling that goes like, “Hmm, thank you that’s very interesting. Okay, thank you.” And you’re like, “Do you have any questions?” And they’re like, “No. No. I’m all good.”

Biagio: Yeah, you bombed that one.

Joke: And then that’s when you’re just like, “And get me the heck out of here.” So those are honestly the worst pitches. The best pitches are the one that start a conversation.

So ideally you pitch your show and the network or your buyer has questions like, “Oh! And how would we work over here?” And sometimes those are creative questions of cast or story telling or half hours or hours or all that stuff. Sometimes its production questions like, “How would you handle with this aspect of production? Or travel? Or can we make it a smaller show than you’re pitching? Or can we blow it up to a bigger show?”

And those are all good questions and the key here is, as Biagio said, is to pivot your pitch. Because you want, ideally, to have multiple buyers interested. Not all buyers are going to want the same show. Your show might work for different buyers but they’re all going to want their own sleigh that fits their brand and their audience and their demographic.

So them asking questions is really them saying, “So can you fit your idea into our brand?” And also, it’s dating. It’s like, “Okay, will you work with me? Does this feel like a good communication?”

With the speed pitch, your pitch is really a date. If you don’t feel a good rapport with the person, or they don’t feel a good rapport with you in terms of the question and answering here, it doesn’t set up a good ‘down the road relationship’.

When someone pitches us an idea and I ask a few questions like, “Okay, but what about this, or what about that?” And I keep getting the same answer that’s like, “No, no, no. This is what it is.” “No, no, no. This is what it is.” Even if there’s something about that idea that I like, I clearly am not going to be able to work with you because you’re not open to discussing anything other than the pitch that you’ve rehearsed.

It’s important to not just shut people down on your pitch and be like, “N-no, you don’t get it.” Or, “No, you don’t get it.” At the same time you don’t want to throw your entire show out the water and be like, “My show is about getting prostitutes off the streets.” “Oh, you like them on the street?” “Sure, well we’ll encourage girls to get on the street.”

Biagio: Yeah, no!

Joke: I’m not saying pivot 180 degrees, but you have to be listening. And honestly, you can help them sell themselves on the idea depending on the answers you give. So it’s really important to listen and again to also sometimes listen to the note behind the note. What are they really struggling with? What are they really asking for?

And then, be prepared to have the answers there but also be strong enough to say, “Actually I don’t have those answers, but let me find out and I’ll get back to you.” That is a perfectly acceptable answer.

Biagio: Totally! This is a show we did a long time ago, “Beauty and the Geek.” So Beauty and the Geek was actually pitched as an arc competition show by non-other than Ashton Kutcher. But for the purposes of illustration, let’s pretend that we were in a pitch meeting for that show.

We walked in and we said, “Listen, we’ve got a great idea for a show, it’s a self-contained hour where one beautiful girl is going to go on a date with 3 geeks. We think it’s going to be amazing because she’s going to learn about them and they’re going to learn about her and in the end she’s going to pick one geek.” Now say that that was the pitch for the show and the network executive had looked at us and said…

Joke: “Well, I don’t know, we’re really looking for arched kind of shows right now, is there an arch show in this?”

Biagio: To which I could’ve either said, “Why yes, I think that’s a great idea! Let’s talk about it. Maybe we’ll make it an arch show. Maybe instead of a standalone, it’s a group of geeks and a group of beauties who work together and maybe there’s an elimination every week and I think that you’re right, the show could work that way.” To which they might have said…

Joke: “Oh, so now you’re taking it away from the dating space and more into kind of working together or not working together?”

Biagio: “Yeah, like a social experiment.”

Joke: “Great! A social experiment! I like that! Ooh, this is kind of a new twist on things.”

Biagio: Now that’s one way that pitch could’ve went, right? Or, it could’ve went like this.

“Hey, so I’ve got this great dating show with one beautiful girl, and 3 geeks, and every episode, they go on a date. And at the end she picks the geek that she likes the best. I think it’s going to be really cool! What do you think?”

Joke: “Yeah, I think there’s definitely something in the beauty and the geek thing. Is there an arched version or kind of more like less dating, maybe more social experiment? Would that be possible?”

Biagio: “No! I’m sorry, I’m sorry you must’ve not understood me. No, no. It’s a one off every episode, its one beauty with three geeks. It’s not arched, it’s not a social – it’s a dating show.”

Joke: “Okay, there’s the door.”

Biagio: “No, I think you just don’t get the show.” We’re now snapping out of play mode, okay.

Joke: Okay, so this example may seem ludicrous to most people listening to it, but we literally had an executive at realscreen tell us a story where someone was pitching them an idea of a show in Italy and he was like, “Okay listen, I don’t know if the show works or not, but I’m really not interested in anything Italian or Italy related. I’m really just focusing on America. So, not this one, because it’s Italian or Italy related. Do you have anything else?”

And the producers’ were like, “Yeah, yeah! Totally!” And then pitched him another Italian show. And then another Italian show, and then another one. And you just go, “I mean, reallys” At that point as the executive, you start going, “Are they dumb? Am I not being heard? Is this a twilight zone or the Punk’d cameras?”

Either way, you’re not going to build a relationship with them. So while you’re pitching may not even be completely right for them or whatever. At the end of the day, it’s still a meeting and it’s still a relationship that you could be building. So it’s important that if you’re pitching a show…

Biagio: Or, by the way, or a movie, or a film, or a web series, Any kind of project.

Joke: Any kind of project that you’re pitching and you feel like, “I cannot pivot this enough or I can’t incorporate their idea into it, it’s just going to be way off,” then just acknowledge that and don’t keep pitching them the same thing. You know what I mean?

Understand what they said and maybe figure out some other, and just start brain storming with them, and say, “Okay, well what kind of worlds are you interested in?” And they might say something that sparks a connection you might have in your address book or whatever.

So it’s all about the conversation and this is a date, and part of it is not just, does the buyer like or not like your idea, your project? It’s also, does the buyer feel like this is a good working collaborative relationship.

Biagio: Yeah, I mean, listen, that’s, the most important thing is to show them you’re listening. Don’t be afraid to brainstorm. And pivoting your pitch doesn’t just mean changing your actual pitch. It means possibly pivoting the meeting if you just know you can’t go far enough with your idea to ever meet the kind of show they’re asking you, or the kind of project they’re asking you to make in the meeting.

So just to wrap up, a few big points I really want you to remember. Remember, if you’re pitching a studio or network on your project, you’re asking them to pay. Which means you’re asking them to partner. So you’ll be collaborating with them to get your project made and that collaboration starts the very first meeting.

Go on with an open mind. Don’t be afraid to brainstorm with the exec and pivot your pitch so that it can possibly move forward or so that you can glean some new information that might help you in a future pitch with the exec.

Also, I want to remind everybody, I know a lot of you have been listening to this podcast for a while, but for those of you who are new, remember that if you’re pitching any factual programming, be it reality TV, documentary series, competition shows, anything that falls in the unscripted bucket, we’re happy to hear your pitches and possibly team up with you.

We just took a handful of projects that came in from this podcast to realscreen with us, right Joke?

Joke: Mm-hmm.

Biagio: Yeah, there were some really good ones. And we are so excited because if any of those go, we’ll be teaming up with those aspiring producers. They’ll be working with us and they’ll be learning a lot about the business as we make their shows together with them.

If you want to learn how to pitch to us, go to our 30th podcast app which is producingunscripted.com/030. For those of you new to the podcast, our first eight apps are a crash course in how to succeed in reality TV and doc series. And if you paid attention to those first eight apps, you’d be head and shoulders above most people who do pitch us, trust me.

You can find those converted to a video slide show with a clickable table of contents over at YouTube.com/jokeandbiagio or on the front page of our site. For this podcast, producingunscripted.com.

Phew! That was a mouthful! Once again, I want to thank you guys for coming out and listening. Joke knows how much I appreciate everyone who listens to the podcast. Joke does too, isn’t that right?

Joke: Yes.

Biagio: Yes. We were actually approached by a handful of you at Realscreen who recognized us. One of the guy who’d said, “I know this going to sound weird, but I recognize your voices from the podcast.” I think we were both a little shocked, but excited! That was a really nice compliment. Or I was just talking way too loud at Realscreen. I don’t know, it depends how you take it.

Joke: I usually can hear you from across the room at Realscreen too.

Biagio: Ah, yeah, I do have to learn to control my volume.

Anyways, we’ll see all of you again in a couple of weeks. Until next time. Good luck with all of your pitches and all of your projects. And remember, when you’re in a Hollywood meeting, don’t be afraid to pivot that pitch.

Joke: Pivot away, ladies and gentlemen.

Announcer: Producing unscripted with Joke and Biagio.